Is it possible to change my husband or should I accept him the way he is?
... but sometimes it seems like it's taking so long to climb them.
Assalamu Alykum
Jazakum Allah khairan for taking the time reading my post. To start, I was married to my husband at the age of 19- when both of us were students & immigrants to Canada. I come from a rather wealthy family, my husband comes from a relatively modest background. I love all the qualities he has, his manners, respect for others, patience, and his care for his parents and siblings (whether financial or emotional- he worked beside school to support himself and to send money to his family), and above all, he is such a caring and loving father .
It has been 5 years now, and we have a 1 year old child. We have survived together difficult moments, delayed graduation, start of family business, buying our first house, infertility and premature delivery etc. But it has also been 6 years that Ive been going through difficult emotions and fear of divorce. I come from a very hardworking (call it workoholic if you wish) family, that takes ambitions and aspirations seriously. My parents worked really hard to provide us with the best education, and the best standard of living in general. When I married my husband, my parents knew he couldnt afford to provide me with the same standards, and they supported me financially by all means to cover our expenses to get ahead in our lives and in our careers, may Allah reward them for all that.I believed in my husband, that he will be inshaAllah all successful in his career, and I tried not to overwhelm him with my financial demands and used to use my family savings if i needed to buy anything, as I didnt want my husband to be distracted from his studies by doing extra side work to meet my needs.
But now what concerns me is that I find him somehow -lazy and lacking a future vision- excuse me if I do not have the right expression but thats how I feel. It has been 6 years that he is doing his degree, and I was always patient (despite some pressure on my side for him to accelerate, but he failed few subjects) and now that he graduated, he is taking it easy to search for a job. Although he is running a family business with his brother, it doesnt cover much of our expenses, let alone that it barely makes any profit. I have to constantly rely on my family savings to pay the monthly mortgage and credit cards etc. to avoid adding up of interest, but I am starting to wonder if there is anything i am doing wrong. I have been avoiding to consult any family member or friend with my personal issues to avoid breaking confidentiality of our marital relationship, but by all means I need to feel that my husband is responsible for this family financially (and other issues too, as he avoids discussing with me how he wants to raise our children and other things I find important for us to discuss, but everytime he starts to get defensive and he ends the conversation right away, for instance, I wish that we get involved with the Muslim community, with the local mosque etc but I always find him critical of the mosque's culture that he wanted to avoid it)-
My question in general is how to make this relationship work? I try to follow the advice of giving unconditional love to encourage him, but I get a lot of pressure from my family on his work status and so on, and I feel pressured and responsible for him instead of the other way around. I approached him with the topic few times and I get an angry response (and sometimes a week of no- talking and bed separation), and now that we have a child, i try to avoid bringing up anything that would lead to such a reaction. Please advise me how to discuss my expectations with my husband, and please do not recommend me to leave this relationship as I know I wouldnt find a man with the abovementioned manners. There are things that we need to work on in our relation and here's where I need guidance and advice, especially from husbands or ex-husbands on this forum who might explain things from my husband's perspective.
Jazakum Allah khairan-
Zawaj.User
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Dear Sister
Your husband seems to be a nice guy with good qualities but professionally he is not up to the mark (from your point of view) . And this should not be the reason for you to think about separation or Divorce .
In Marriages you have all sorts of Ups and Downs and you need to face it positively and move ahead .
Under the context of his modest background his current state might look like a failure to him but for you it is a failure (as you came from rich background) .So this is a normal conflict when some one from rich background marries a man of modest background .
You need to sit with him and discuss whether his family business worth to do if it can not cover your family expenditures .
If he is doing business then he might not be getting right time to prepare and search for the jobs .
Lot of families struggle with finance and it is wrong to think about divorce because of this issue .
Please look in to below hadith
It is reported in the hadith of the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allah be upon him), "If a women asks her husband for a divorce, for no reason, then the smell of paradise is forbidden for her". (At-Tirmidhi narrated it. He said this is a hasan hadith. Sunnah At-Tirmidhi #1187.)
Also refer to below fatwa
http://islamqa.info/en/488
Dear Editors ,
Can you please delete the information regarding Hadith and fatwa of IslamQA in my first post here.
Brother Anonymous has raised has some concern about it as i am not a religious scholar and authorized person for it and as per him it is out of context and might confuse the sister .
As I want to be on safer side so request you to delete that part .
Jazak Allah .
OK. I'm going to disagree with Logical. Part of the responsibility of a husband in Islam is to support his family. I suspect that the willingness of his wife's family to support him has lulled this husband into being a bit relaxed in seeking employment.
Her family is supporting them. She needs to have a serious discussion with him, and hold a credit card shredding because if they are living off of her family they can't afford to have credit cards.
I'm afraid that hadith hurling at women regarding their Islamic responsibilities while making excuses for men who indulging in bad behavior is all too common on this website. Especially since she explicitly stated that she is *opposed* to obtaining a divorce. It is also good to find out what is meant by "no reason" before quoting an hadith out of context. Then there is the amal, the actual practice of the people of Medina that takes precedence over hadith in Maliki fiqh.
Dear Anonymous ,
This is a conflict where a rich woman got married to man from modest background .
It is 100 % correct that Islamically husband is responsible for all finance towards family and provide descent living but question is how good life style he needs to provide ?
Like if he just provides housing ,clothing ,food and other necessitates is enough or he needs to have long term vision of earning more money to provide lavish life .
Please note that our beloved prophet (SAS) and Sahabas lived a very simple life .
As per her he is trying to run some family business and that income is not enough to run the family .So basically he is struggling to run the business and get a job .Its better if they both discuss this and also good idea if they meet some career counselors ..
Sister ,
One more thing i can suggest you that please tell your husband that your family has stopped all your financial help and he needs to provide everything to run a family .
In case if you have got used to lavish spending because of rich background then you need to cut down your costs and try to have a simple life .(in case )
So over all
-->Discuss with your husband and say your family now can't support you
-->Send him to some career counselor to get a help
-->Cut down your costs and lead a simple life.
-->Be realistic one can not become rich overnight even if he has right attitude .It will depends on the situation ,destiny etc etc ..
So questions still remains here ,
If he can provide simple life style to your family is enough or he needs to provide lavish life style to the family to be called as a husband who has fulfilled his duty ?
Allah hafiz
Here is what the Sister said:
I have to constantly rely on my family savings to pay the monthly mortgage and credit cards etc. to avoid adding up of interest, but I am starting to wonder if there is anything i am doing wrong.
She also said:
I come from a rather wealthy family, my husband comes from a relatively modest background.
And she further stated:
Please advise me how to discuss my expectations with my husband, and please do not recommend me to leave this relationship as I know I wouldnt find a man with the abovementioned manners.
So, Logical, Since she wasn't interested in divorce, it was a purely gratuitous action on your part to hurl that hadith in her direction -, and in my opinion, doing so was very poor adab - in essence, you were accusing her of two things for which you have no evidence - first,- seeking a divorce, and second, seeking a divorce without valid reason.
It is clear her husband is not supporting her family to the standard of living that he seems to prefer or her family would not be paying the mortgage and the credit card bills. The first thing she needs to do is shred the credit cards. Then she can consider other cuts - take out any gratuitous services, such as TV cable, replacing fancy cellular phone plans with the least expensive, simplest service available, etc.
She needs to have a tactful talk with him about the fact that the parental well is going to be running dry and that he needs to put on his big boy pants. She needs to have her budget figures lined up and show what services can be cut and how much they will save.
It is amazing how many men go out and look for better jobs when they learn that the first place to cut the budget is in recreation and entertainment.
OK. Her family is rather wealthy, not necessarily rich. His background is relatively modest, not necessarily poor.
Her family is supporting them while he is rather apathetic about finding a means to support the family.
Anonymouse,
Great response from start to finish! And yes, it seems that hadith gets used all the time as if to suggest that there could never ever be a reason.
Saba ,Always there will be some reason. If some one is struggling in his career or business or something which is not a major thing ,will you advice them to get divorced ? The Hadith is relevant even though that sister is not going for that but she has mentioned that fear in those years ..This is authentic hadith ...
Logical, she wasn't interested in divorce; she made it clear in her post. Why do you accuse her - without proof - of wanting a divorce without reason?
Anonymous ,
Who is accusing her about the divorce ?
I was asking a general question to Saba to her last reply .So please don't simply write some thing .
Sharing a authentic hadith is not aggainst Adaab and it is not an accusation .This will give information and it was relevant to this context .
I have suggested lot of other points too and you are simply taking this hadith part and blowing out of proportion unnecessarily .
Allah hafiz
Will I advise them to get divorced? If you read my comment below, you will find out.
If you think that I would advise someone to divorce over something minor, then there is little I can say. The only one talking about divorce, that I see so far, is you.
Logical, you posted the following in response to a Sister who specifically stated that she was NOT interested in ending her marriage. You in essence implied that she was guilty of two things - seeking a divorce, and seeking a divorce for no reason. Your post gave the appearance of being not only non-responsive, but accusatory and suggests that you did not read her entire posting and instead leaped to conclusions that were not justified with no evidence.
You might not have meant to do so, but your reply seemed to show little concern for the real problems faced by the Sister and her child, and a lot of reaction to non-existent intentions and justifications of her husband's non-support.
Please look in to below hadith
It is reported in the hadith of the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allah be upon him), "If a women asks her husband for a divorce, for no reason, then the smell of paradise is forbidden for her". (At-Tirmidhi narrated it. He said this is a hasan hadith. Sunnah At-Tirmidhi #1187.)
Also refer to below fatwa
http://islamqa.info/en/488
Anonymous ,
As I said before, I have not accused her for asking divorce .
I have shared some information with regards to that Hadith and IslamQA fatwa at the end .If you have noted my post I have suggested lot of other points too and it is unwanted to drag only this part .
If you read my post I have not justified her husband's action .I have told her to stop giving money to him and tell him to manage it on its own . Also i have suggested her to send him to some career counselor etc . Also advised her to cut the costs and be realistic about the situation .
Allah hafiz
Akhi, the thing is you admit she wasn't seeking divorce, but you decided to hurl an hadith about divorce since supposedly it was "relevant."
Ya Allah! There is enough misunderstanding of the Sunnah that having people share an hadith just because it is "authentic" - although irrelevant - only adds to the confusion.
You posted an hadith out of context and then referenced a fatwa. Are you aware that fatawa are considered binding only on the one who requests them because circumstances may vary, among other issues? Are you also aware that most of the serious scholars - including Muftis - try to avoid giving fatawa because they will be responsible before Allah (SWT) for their actions? Do you really want the responsibility of telling someone that an hadith fits their situation, and that further more they are bound by a fatwa given to someone else in what were possibly very different circumstances?
I am NOT a scholar, although I have taken a few classes with a Shaykh from Mauretania. One thing I learned was the extreme caution a scholar uses.
Assalamoalikum Anonymous ,
Thanks for raising these concerns and sure I will be very careful in future .
Yes , It is a risk for me and also I can't take responsibility because I am not a religious scholar .
Thanks again for putting this concern in my mind and sure i will be extreme cautious and careful next time .
But there are some questions now raised in my mind
1)Suppose if Hadith and Fatwa were relevant to this context then was it was fine to share here ?
2)Whenever we share a fatwa from any authentic site( like IslamQA ), normally it will be issued by qualified scholars ( these are not our words) .Don't you think the person who is looking for help can relate whether this fatwa is applicable to him/her under his context ?
I am not defending myself and to be honest side i want to be in safer side and not share much .
3)I have seen many people in this site keeps sharing Quranic verses and Hadiths while answering queries .What is your view here , this can be a dangerous trend here as most of them are not religious scholars and information passed might not be correct or relevant one ?
Is this the time Editors should take serious note of it and start filtering these ?
Overall I agree its better to be silent than sharing religious information if there is risk of going it wrong . Thanks for pointing it out .
Allah hafiz
Assalam alaikum,
I agree that it may not be wise to discuss your personal relationship with your parents, without first trying some things.
You say that your parents are the ones that are financially supporting you. I don't know how the funds arrive at your end, but hopefully they don't go directly into his account all this time. Is it possible for you to begin reducing the amount to half for the next 3 or 4 months and then to a quarter and then to none. Don't fight, just say, my parents think that because you are finished your studies, you should be able to make ends meet now. It is HIS responsibility and afterall it has been 6 six years. I suggest that you keep that money aside for now. It could be that you are a bit over-involved in the finances and you need to back off and let him own up to his part of this marriage.
I don't think giving your silent treatment and separating beds with you is reasonable because you ask him about his plans--he needs to think about this a bit more. Some cities have classes on finances within a marriage within the context of Islam--perhaps you both can attend that OR find one online. OR goto counselling classes together to talk about these specific items that you need help with.
Avoid fighting with him, but whatever you do choose to do, do so with a firm stance without engaging in fighting with him. He may not be able to provide for you to the level that you want initially, but inn shaa Allah, when he feels the pressure to do what he has to, hopefully he will step up fulfill his duties.
May Allah ease your difficulties, Ameen.
Salam sister Saba,
Great advise Masha Allah! As usual.
I haven't heard from you lately. Hope you are well IA.
Xxx
Wa alaikum assalam Sr. Sumaira,
Ramadhan Mubarak and hope it is going well for you--and yes, I have been a little more than busy than usual, and Alhumdulillah for that.
Hope you are in the best of health and Imaan, inn shaa Allah!
Salam sister,
I agree with the above. Some men become lazy when the wife provides for the family. You need to stop giving him money or paying the bills.
Don't pay a penny! You just look after the household let him take care of the bills. Once the mortgage is not paid and you stand to lose your home then he will realize that he will have to get of his back side and get a better job or better paid job to cover the basic neccesities, food shelter and clothing.
You are not expecting much at all. All you want is your husband that provide for you. That is his obligation and your obligation is to look after the household and your child. So why are you taking on both roles? Just relax and leave the money matters to him.
Don't say anything to him just let the pressure fall on him then he will start working! Im sure he will not want to put you guys on the street!
May Allah bless your marriage.
Assalamu alaikum,
Dear sister Zawaj... You and I have similar stories. Please know that you are not alone.
I also have been told to stop paying for things. I have learned that doing this is an act of enabling, but I haven't figured out how to NOT pay for things as I have a decent job. It is scary for sure. I just wish that my husband would step up and do what he needs to do. I am sure you feel the same way in your relationship as well.
Small steps insha'Allah. Offer to help him create a resume. Offer to help him scout for jobs. It is almost like having a child and taking their hand, but if you are committed to the relationship, then you do what you can. Just be sure to not lose yourself in the process...and set limits for yourself. Ultimately, this is HIS responsibility.
May Allah ease your difficulties.
Dear Sister,
Assalam alaikum,
I have a suggestion on how to stop paying for things--if you are really struggling with this, then try to cut down on an extras that you can do without. Do not have your accounts on prepaid directly to your account. Simply stack up the bills and give them to your husband and let the consequences come forth without being the "parent" and dealing with it all on your own. If this is too much, do this for one bill at a time and let it be gradual. The key is also to never engage in arguments and keep the focus on the issue rather than make it about something else. May Allah make it easy for you, inn shaa Allah.
Brother Logical -
I do not know the answers to your questions; I have some idea of what I think the answer is, but I am not a scholar.
Personally, I try to be very, very careful. I am leery of quoting hadith for reasons I will give below. I am more comfortable checking books of fiqh intended for the average Muslim, and so I will check The Guiding Helper or 'Uthman dan Fodio, or A Madinan View, or The Muwatta in an effort to answer questions and I will quote a general guidance for the normal condition - but I try to remind people I am not a scholar. Sometimes I call a friend of mine whose son is a student of Shaykh Salek bin Siddina and have her ask him and if needed he can ask the Shaykh. These are general things, such as the general requirements on both spouses, etc.
The problem with ahadith is that they can have deeper meanings that are not apparent on the surface and it takes years, if not decades, to understand them and their meanings and so on. They are considered "a trap for the unwary" by some.
I don't have the knowledge required to reconcile between the various ahadith which apparently contradict each other, nor do I know which verses of the Qur'an are general in their application and which verses are qualified by other texts. Since I lack this knowledge, I personally do not have the ability to derive the laws directly from the Qur'an and Hadith. The one thing I can be sure of is that the following ayat definitely applies to me:: "Ask those of knowledge if you do not know." (43:7)