Islamic marriage advice and family advice

Parents not agreeing to my choice of wife because she is a different caste

caste system prejudice

The caste system is not from Islam. It prevails in the Indian Subcontinent because of Hindusim.

Asalamoalaikom. I am a 26 year old male from Pakistan and I have been in a relationship with a girl of my age since the past over 2.5 years. In this course of time, we have kept limited meetings, although we live in the same area, 10 minutes away from each other, (to avoid committing sinful and immoral acts) and Alhamdolillah we have always tried to maintain a clean relationship.

First time I told my mom about this girl, it was around 5-6 months of knowing her...for the first 3 months, this girl was out of country, and I had not even met her..as we met online...but then when she came back, we met a few times, just to know each other, and we always met staying within the limits of shariah.

It was then that I decided to tell about her to my mother, and I did hesitate a little bit first because theres a problem of caste in our family, but then decided that I have not done anything wrong by deciding to marry a girl out of caste, and can talk about it to my parents.

I never flirted with this girl, and I never treated her like my girlfriend, and she is a very pure girl MashAllah and religiously inclined too. She helped make me regular in my namaz as she offers her own namaz regularly, and helped me start reading Quran regularly as well. Sometimes, when I used to call her and ask her what is she doing, she would tell me she's reading Quran, and that would make me feel embarrassed as to why dont I read the Quran, thus I started reading the Quran as well.

She never used bad language with me, never insulted me in any way, never asked for anything from me, and loved me for what I was, rather than what I have...as many other materialistic girls.

Now the problem is, my parents never listened to me seriously about this girl in the beginning. I told them to talk to me about this matter, when they have time but twice they did not talk on this matter with me. Then I asked a cousin of mine to call up my mother and ask her to talk to me...and thats when they first time sat with me, and I seriously told them that I want to marry this girl. By this time, I had already known this girl for 1 year.

When I asked my parents why they did not talk to me before, my father's response was that 'we thought you would forget about it.' I was surprised at the attitude of my parents that they thought that I'm only having a temporary relationship with a girl and I'll forget her myself. They kept their heads stuck under the sand.

Anyways, I told them to talk to the girl's parents (there is caste issue on her side as well) but I told my parents that they should talk and Allah will create ways, and they should not give me excuse that the girl is out of caste.

Thus I did manage to get them to talk to the girl's elder sisters...but they only used to talk to her side when I used to nag them. Once again, their non-serious attitude was confusing for me. All this time, the girl waited for me.

Then, on my constant nagging, my parents went to the girl's house but after they came back they simply told me that they did not like the girl's appearance, and they think that she and her family is not compatible with us.

I was shocked to hear this from my parents. When I have selected a girl, then shouldn't they be confident about my choice? I see the girl to be compatible with me... I see her good looking too... somehow I cannot digest the reasons my parents have given me. They think that I have just been blinded by a girl, whereas this girl did not say anything wrong to me ever. In fact, I was the one who chose her, and she accepted me... although she has never been in a relationship with any other boy.

I told all the truth to my parents, but they just take the bad aspect of all the details I give them... like when I said I met the girl online, they asked me, if she talked to you, then imagine how many more boys she might talk to online... etc etc...

Well, I know this girl... inside out... I am not blind... this is the FIRST girl in my life whom I have told to my parents about... that I want to marry her... so I saw in her, what I havent seen in any other girl and thats why I decided about marriage.

I dont want to commit any sins... I dont want to destroy the life of this girl... after committing with her that I will talk and make my parents agree... and I dont want to destroy my own life...

My intention has always been clean towards this girl, but my parents think ill of her without any reason. They have failed to give me any other reason besides that they did not like her appearance and they think that she's not compatible with me, and that she looks elder to me.

I have tried a lot to convince my parents, but in vain. I dont want to sin by not listening to my parents either... or by disobeying them. They have given me everything in life, but I dont know why they are acting stubborn in this regard. I also told them to do istikhara about it, but they simply refused even to do that! They said, when we have decided that we dont want to marry you there, then we dont need to do istikhara.

However, the girl has done istikhara thrice...two times she saw two moons...one crescent and one full moon out of the window in her dream...and one time she dreamed of cute triplet babies in her lap..she is covering her head with a dopatta..and she gives one baby to her sister...

She asked a learned person she knows to do istikhara as well...and he also told her that this rishta will be prosperous if they proceed with it...

I have done istikhara myself and I have seen in my dream that I am sitting with this girl, reciting Quran in loud voice to her...

I know all the istikharas shows positiveness...and the girl's family is also religious...and one should select families and girls on the basis of their religion rather than appearance...but then whats stopping my parents...I dont understand.

I now pray 4-5 times in a day...and even go to the masjid...and in every dua, I ask for this girl...

I am much more close to Allah as well than before...

Maybe your answers in this regard can help me out.

- nomicool

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51 Responses »

  1. Brother Nomicool, As-salamu alaykum,

    Sorry to hear about the difficult time you are going through. As you may know, we do not have castes in Islam. That is a Hindu concept. In Islam, all human beings are equal. The only thing that makes one person superior to another is taqwa, consciousness of Allah, faith, and behavior.

    Your parents are not behaving reasonably. Why should they judge the girl's appearance? They are not the ones who will kiss her every day. As long as you find her attractive, that should be enough.

    The problem is that in families where parents are used to making all the decisions, and look at their adult children as still being "children", they tend to discount the child's opinions. They have a hard time understanding that it's now your turn to be an adult and make decisions. Marriage in particular is one of those crucial transitions where you go from being your parents's child, to becoming a parent yourself. Your parents are clearly not recognizing this important transition.

    I suggest that you find someone who can speak on your behalf. Maybe a local Imam or Shaykh. Explain the situation and have the Imam speak to your parents and tell them that there are no castes in Islam, and that they should respect your decision.

    If that does not work, then I suggest going ahead and marrying the girl, assuming she will have you without your parents' involvement. Your parents' opinion in this matter is based on unIslamic factors and I feel you are justified in continuing on your own.

    Wael
    IslamicAnswers.com Editor

    • Because i am in a similar situation as the girl i would like to add my view. The person i want to marry is told to make a choice between me and his parents bcz they dont want me in ther family no matter what. I think marrying without parental consent is too difficult. Because if u and the wife have issues u may run bak to hear them sayin i told u so. Either way u hav to be so strong. If they accept her n then u marry her they may not be accepting of her, n ul have to stick up for her. If u leave them u need to stik by ur decision too. This is a painful decision. I wish ppl would preach on the importance of tolerance of caste and race in masjids too. And talk bout these issues. Parents ruin lives with their emotional demands.

      • "I wish ppl would preach on the importance of tolerance of caste and race in masjids too. And talk bout these issues."

        I agree.

        If any of you readers are from India or Pakistan, I am curious: How common is this idea of "caste" among Muslims? What is it based on? Is it based on profession? Income? Lineage? Do Muslims understand that such a system has no basis in Islam? What is the justification for it?

        Wael
        IslamicAnswers.com Editor

        • Assalam O Alaikum brother Wael:)-
          I just came across this question and thought my information might help you understand. Caste system is wide spread in India and Pakistan especially in Hindus and Muslims as well. It all depends on the level of education and someone's personal circumstances and there are some other factors too like if parents want to get their daughter/son married within their family/tribe/caste then, they will do it without giving any justification (in fact there is no justificatio as we Muslims look at the life of Holy Prophet PBUH, the greatest of role model, world has ever seen, he married from different tribes just to promote this within Muslims). But, now I think people are changing there and I can tell you that within my family my cousins (sisters/brothers) have married from outside most of the time. We have had two marriages in close family, both my first cousins but they didn't work out and ended up divorced. Other couple (both my first cousins are together just because of their children even they had LOVE MARRIAGE).
          So, it's not Islamic as we know but then their culture comes before religion even in the families where head of the family or both parents are considered quite religious. It's all complicated but I can say all my cousins are Alhamdullilah, Alhamdullilah (countless times) married happily.
          I hope this helped.
          Wasalam mks1982:)-

        • I suffer from the same ailment as that given by sister Aliya. Only in my case.. it has been six years now. Four years of quiet informing and waiting for the right time, and two years of active pursuing.. to no avail.

          The arguments of caste have been thrown at the guy so often that he now no longer has the same strong sense of right and wrong as before.

          What hurts me the most is, his parents got his sister enagged in same caste twice, only to be broken and then married her to her cousin (same caste again) but the marriage is such that the girl now lives with her parents along with her over 1 year old baby. And still, the guy's mother is pressing him, 'marriage to this girl won't work out. no body will accept it. marriage by choice is haraam. noone will ask of your children.'...

          Issue of castes and communities are too rampant... too strong is the god of castes and communities that Allah and His religion sit underneath it. (naaozubillah). These people are apparently very religious. Men grow beards, women veil their faces, they go to every other Quranic/ religious lecture being given. The mother of this guy has herself attended the whole Quran tafseer class in one of very good and reputable religious organizations here in Pakistan. Knowing all this I was hopeful for the first four years that when the guy starts actively pursuing me with them, they will understand. But sad it is...

          Why won't Allah come and help us against this god of caste and creed? Why do elders support this god under the facade of obedience to parents and ehsaan to parents.?

          Hanging in the balance, painfully very much.

          • No, the first and foremost thing this caste system depends on is, 'lineage'..
            Memons, Pathans, Sindhis, Punjabis, Muhajir, Balochis.. Dehliwalas.. Hayderabadis..

            It's lineage.

          • How old are you? And are your parents not pushing u to marry someone else? Are his parents suggestin other girls for him? X

        • Caste system is very popular in Pakistan. I belong to a syed family and going through exactly the same. It’s been 2 and half years trying to convince my parents but no results. We have come down to just seeking help through patience and prayers. May Allah help us all ameen

      • i know that he loves me and it's not fair for the girl that he's going to marry bc his heart will always be with him. i'm i wrong to try convincing him to break the engagement and try to convince his parents about us. or can we just get married and then tell his parents?

        • Peace be with you Mary,

          You should log in and submit your question as a seperate post, a short answer to your question, what you call engagement probably is already a marriage, please stay away from this man, if you mantain your connection to him will be a neverending source of suffering, as it has already become. Please, tell him to be honest to you. You are not alone on this, Mary. Please, look for help if you cannot handle it alone, we are here for you too, if God(swt) allows it.

          May God(swt) ease your suffering. Ameen.

          From Heart to Heart,

          María
          IslamicAnswers.com Editor

  2. The Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “There is no obedience if it involves disobedience towards Allaah; obedience is only in that which is right and proper.” Narrated by (al-Bukhaari (7257) and Muslim (1840).

    Brother Wael, from my knowledge I believe the caste system is ultimately based on wealth, which goes hand-in-hand with status. They also use a lot of astrology to determine people's "worth". SubhanAllah. There is a fiction book, called "A Fine Balance" and it gets into the caste system mentality and the type of oppression people have to deal with because of the family they were born in. The caste system breeds a next level arrogant mentality where people justify their cruelty to others merely because they consider themselves better. Though finances change, the linage and mental holds strong.

    May Allah subhanhu wa tala Protect us from ignorance .. Ameen

  3. Thanks everyone for your replies. I have been waiting for long for my question to get published.

    I know my parents are wrong but I have failed to convince them. I have tried everything, but still they dont listen. According to their views, its wrong for me to choose a girl as wife for myself...because I talked to her...chatted with her...and know everything about her! And of course they say, "she does not SUIT with you..."...as if I'm the world's most handsome stud!

    Is it wrong for me to even talk to a girl and get to know her? I mean, I can ONLY decide AFTER talking to a girl, to choose her as my wife! How else do choice marriages happen? Do the girls come in your dreams, along with their names and addresses and you just tell them to your parents? OF COURSE YOU HAVE TO get to know someone to make this decision, that this girl should be your wife!

    And I have mentioned in my original post that I told my parents about her from the very beginning...its not that I was into wrong acts with this girl, and after that I told my parents that I want to marry her...NO...this was NOT the case.

    We kept a clean relationship ALHAMDOLILLAH...and its because I thought I would let my parents know about her, so they can arrange my marriage with her! My parents never listened to me...and ignored me when I asked them to talk to me on this matter. They thought that she's just a random girl, and I'm just a crazy guy, and will eventually forget her, if they keep ignoring me.

    What they dont understand is, that this is the FIRST girl in my LIFE whom I have talked to them about, and about whom I have told them that I want to get married to her. They have FAILED to give me ANY logical reason for rejecting the girl.

    Isnt it my right to choose the girl of my choice? How can I choose a wife, if I dont know the girl?

    Whenever I met this girl in the beginnning, we did NO immoral acts...and we always met at a public place...and I talked to her and saw her to get to know more about her...in order for me to finalize my decision and ultimately talk to my parents about her. I did EVERYTHING cleanly at that time...but now, I feel like sinning...I'm going astray...my parents dont listen to me...whats the use of me staying away from all the girls...I have everything that can attract girls...and plenty of girls have come after me...still I stay away from them...but now I think whats the use of being sincere with one girl...when my parents can simply reject the girl of my choice without giving me any valid reason!

    I should be like other boys, who flirt and enjoy with girls and in the end they simply marry the girl their parents choose for them!

    I feel I made false commitments with a girl...I broke her heart...her life is devastated because she waited for me to convince my parents...she rejected her proposals because of me. I have been unable to give her, what I promised her for. I have been unable to convince my parents. Why are they being so stubborn! I dont understand!

    I will implement the suggestion about involving some learned person inshAllah...but going ahead and marrying the girl of my choice, without my parents consent, is not an option for me...its not in our society...a society where parents, even if wrong, are right...and you have to obey to everything they say.

    Is there any wazifa for me, that I can do, that can make things easy for me? Some dua etc for making my parents' hearts and minds soft and open?

    • As salamu alaykum noomicol,

      I am not going to give you a recipe to change your parents´ mind, because I do believe the only person we can change is ourselves and for that you are plenty of prayers, beginning for the one to relieve anxiety and sorrow, that you need so much right now.

      I am really sorry to listen that you have no options, is it an economical issue? or is it a social issue?

      Through your words it seems that you have been dating this girl, in the most innocent ways but stil dating, you don´t mention the presence of a mahram in your encounters, and if you read any of the many questions here, once you are interested in a girl, you should tell your parents and go to her parents, you did this at the end and this is supposed to be done at the beginning, ...... watching what has happened to you and this girl, both of you are heartbroken right now, that makes sense.

      You want to rebel against everything because you are full of pain, anger and frustration. You gave your Word and now you realized that your Word without your parents consent is not enough, that hurts, more when you are a grown up,straight man.

      The only thing I would recommend here is to learn which is the Straight process to get involved with a muslim woman to marry her, once you know every detail about it then you will know exactly what to do.
      You are being proved as a son, as a man, as a muslim, and I believe you are being tested mainly as a muslim, then your answers are in Allah(swt) Hands, and I give you faith that if you go inwardly towards Him, you will find the answers and the Peace of Heart that you need right now to do what you are called to do. It is a big effort what I am going to ask you but don´t ask for her to be your wife in your prayers, ask for the best for you and for her, whatever Allah(swt) considers is the best for both of you, that will soften both of your Hearts and will bring what is straight for both of you.

      Please, don´t make your parents the focus of your anger, they are doing what they consider the best for you, even when they maybe wrong,...many things we don´t understand while we are son/daughter, but we begin to understand when we ourselves become parents, try your best to show them unconditional respect and love, even when sometimes is a bit difficult.

      Please look for Peace in your Heart in Allah(swt), He is the only One that can hold you to get through all this situation in the best way possible.

      All my Unconditional Love and Respect,

      María

      • I dont agree fully with your answer, i agree with most parts like how u shud involve parents early and show parents respect etc. But it sounds like the guy tried to have pure intentions to get to no her, yes he should have had another person present too but overall he did tell his parents soon after meeting her. Now this problem with caste, culture race is totally unfounded. Its wrong. Ot is him who wil live his life with her, his choice is imperative. Im sorry i fully blame the parents especially if there kids do make a mistake then they shud be willing to help the child fulfill his promises and enter a halal union. Y r they torturing him and his emotions? Its pretty ridiculous. In my situation, his parents wil not accept me even tho they can see their son is determined for their blessing. Its closedmindedness. If he doesnt stick up for his own choice now he may as well always just put his own hapiness last and his parents first. Parents are very important but they shouldnt take advantage of their position.

        • As salamu alaykum Aliya,

          There is something I want to share with you from what I have been watching through all this kind of cases that come here to look for help. It is in your hand to change the society you are in, you fill a glass of water, drop by drop, insha´Allah, most of you complain about the way things are done, but noone moves a finger, with this I mean if you really feel so right about what you say why do you think you are not strong enough to change the way the things are. That is why I asked noomicol which was his point to avoid marrying her, social or economical?

          The parents´ blessing to the marriage is the best, but being men and women of almost 30 waiting for at least two years to marry someone, what is that strong force that stops you from getting married to that one you believe is the one? You should think about it and once you have done it, you may see why you rely so much on the decision the parents make, and after that you may not blame them, insha´Allah.

          About Noomicol, he is a straight man, an extremely straight man with a sweet soft Heart, I haven´t doubted in any moment about his good intentions towards the girl, but after maybe 3 years waiting, he feels he cannot go against his parents, and what I think about that is, that in his inner self he knows that if he doesn´t have the approval of the parents it is not going to be a good marriage even when both of them are so much for the other, and you know what in someway that will be the way, because even when we don´t agree many times with them, we care about them and this kind of conflict will affect the couple sooner or later. It is easy to say, well go and live your life you are separated from your parents, but that is not the way this function in this kind of society, unless the couple are one, and that takes lots of unconditional love to get, I am not saying it is impossible, I am saying that it is hard work day by day, insha´Allah.

          And related to you, you are more or less in the same situation. It is the easiest way to blame the parents, the hardest is to move ahead,... one of the differences I see in you, is that you are a woman, and that is a huge difference, you have to go for real, the time for a woman is not the same than for a man, ... if you see that this man is for you for real, and for real I mean, he will stand for you in front of everyone, then wait for him, if he shakes even a hair, move ahead, because if you keep feeding this "dream" you will have to stop dreaming one day, and that will take you a while, and that is time too, then I would tell you, go for real, and don´t blame others, go ahead without bitterness, anger or deception, because this way, you will keep your Heart clean and pure to give and receive the best you deserve, and this way you will help this man to move forward too, in whichever direction Allah(swt) has designed for both of you, insha´Allah.

          Other thing I want to tell you, what I see in both cases that is tested is not the submision to the parent´s will, if you go a bit deeper here what is really tested is your submision to Allah(swt), because in both cases you don´t get what you want and instead of surrendering to Allah(swt), to go to Him to give Him your Heart, you do other things guided by your dissapointment. Go to the roots of the problem, go to what is really being tested, pray with your Heart in your hands, go to Him with the emptyness and all the deception you have and talk to Him through your prayers, He is always listening to us, He knows all the answers, He cares about us, ....be sure and firm about it and you will see changes, insha´Allah.

          Allah(swt) knows best.

          May Allah (swt) fill your Heart with Softness, Unconditional Love and guides your steps through the Straight Path, insha´Allah.

          • All my Unconditional Love and Respect,

            María

          • You cant say that in my situation we havent submitted to god and tried to ask for the best. We all get weak but ultimately that is what we did. Im sorry its v easy for someone else to say move forward with no anger or regret. Easier said than done i think.

          • The strong force that stops you from running away, is the love and respect for your parents. I would never let him leave them. Our culture is family focused and thats lovely. But again im sorry this respect shouldnt be an excuse to ruin someones emotions. Emotional blackmail is strong and often ppl think theyl be to blamed for consequences. So that is the so called strong force y ppl dont leave. Some ppl do leave n parents should appreciate that there son is asking something from them respectfully

          • As salamu alaykum Aliya,

            Please forgive if in any point I was wrong, I am just a normal human being trying to be at your side if I can in the best way possible.

            It is healthy to a point to feel regret and pain, what it is not healthy is staying there, because that rottens the Heart, and in a point even if everything turns as you want you will be full of wounds to heal, that was what I meant. And the only thing I meant is that the only One that can offers you Comfort, ease your suffering and guides you is Allah(swt).

            I cannot solve your situation, I cannot tell you what to do, I can offer you sugestions based in my own experience and choices in life, and for sure you are the one that is living in your own bones your suffering, but I know that we are quite strong but to mantain this kind of suffering for so long in time is not healthy, for noone. You are feeling bitter, your character and your Heart are not the same, where is the smile in your Heart? where is the shine in your eyes?

            You may think this happens only in your culture, but this emotional blackmail you talk about happens everywhere, more often between the mothers in law and the wife, but still there somewhere, but is not so strong that can avoid a marriage, but it can turn so strong that can ruin it. This is bitter, but as I said before the only way to go above this obstacle is being one inside the couple and beyond of all surrendering to Allah(swt) as you said you have done.

            Barak Allah feekum, Aliya.

            María

          • Yes what i mean, is respectful children dont walk out on their parents with little reason. Parents wil not be here frever but we owe them a lot. And ur ryt this blackmail occurs evrywhere. And it is upto the two ppl to stay strong. I dunno if his parents will ever give up the stubborness its been so long. I no its changed me as a person but i dont dwell on it. Its life. Yeah im more cynical n less loving. Maybe thatl change one day

          • Insha´Allah, my dear Aliya. Heal your pain with Allah´s(swt) Unconditional Love.

            Alhamdulillah, He is plenty of Love for all of us, Alhamdulillah.

      • If u read the full question i originally posted then its easier to understand how thiscmakes u lose faith in ppl, in kindness and in equality. Its not just an issue of not marryin who u want. It becomes hard. Thanks for the advice x

        • My beloved Aliya,

          I see how tough have been your situation and how hurt you are for all of this. Life gives you experiences likes this to see how deep your roots are, with time you will understand why you went through all this pain.

          When we are innocent and unexperienced we believe that what surrounds us is what it is, you had a sweet and soft Heart and still there, but to survive in this tough world you had to cover it with some hardness, when you have childrens you have to make a choice yourself to grow up them in an enviroment where everytime they get hurt you have to teach them how to deal in the healthiest way with the pain, and try to mantain as much as we can their innocence but without putting them in a bubble. Difficult task.

          The ideal is to be kind, respectful, equal, loving, honest,....and all what you can think off as the good qualities to deal with, but the reality is that we live in a world of polarity and we have that, the opposite and everything in between, what does this mean? That faster you realize this, faster you will get to know who people really are and faster you will learn how to expect from everyone, this way you won´t loose faith in people because you will see their Hearts and you will know what to expect from them, insha´Allah.

          I believe people is the same more or less everywhere, economical, cultural, race, religion, even in the most "sophisticated" societies even when most of us ( I want to believe most of us) wants to be tolerant, and good hearted people the "being different thing" is still around, you don´t see rich people mixing with poor people normally, or people from differents backgrounds getting mixed, this are the exeptions, then we would like something that is still trying to flourish, but still not here.

          My beloved Aliya, one day you will be the expression of all that you would like to find in people around you, you will choose all of these qualities with Allah´s blessings, insha´Allah, from that day on you will see from the shiness of your Heart the shining and the clouds of the others, and you will feel their process and you will grow up in understanding, insha´Allah.

          Thank you very much for listening to me, for sharing your time, your experience and your Heart with me, I deeply appreciate it.

          Always in my Heart,

          María

  4. I strongly feel as Muslims we live our life’s blessings through our parents but at the same time parents should learn to let go. Because the choices we need to make need to be the correct ones for us and if there is something you strongly feel then parents should listen up. I don’t believe in love after marriage that’s my personal choice as certain people are not made for each other but use the marriage label as marriage for inconvenience due to the pressures of family members. If you truly believe this is the girl you want then you have to do what’s best for you, or the other hand you have is marrying someone who is completely different to what you wanted of your parent’s choice. The caste system I do not believe in it is from Hinduism and we as Muslims should be united together regardless of someone’s status, background etc labelling people is wrong just go by what you know and see and inshallah it will be for the best.

  5. islam gives us a right that when you like each other you can marry on the same point az our holy prohet NABI |(S.A.W) has done it and geting married completes 50% of the deen!
    so i dnt knw y our parnets go ahead and force us about culture! when our prophet NABI (S.A.W) married in difrnt cultures when he gave us right not to distingusih anyone due to clour creed and caste now y are we not respecting the decision of word sunnah! that guy will surely get the girl if he could go ahead and marry that gal right away beczu he loves her and the gal too lves him then at the day of judgement the parents wd be asked y they did wrong with their children!
    a perfect parent is that one who follows islam not culture and who respects the maarraige decisionz of their children.. like in this case the guy shd get married allah bless this guy and surely bro you go ahead and mrry dnt worry once you marry this girl even if mom dad are nt with you our allah is with you . he will help you then ur mom dad wd agree

  6. Maybe Islam doesnt have the caste system- but culturally it is followed especially in South Asia . Muslims in India, Pakistan , B'desh etc identify themselves by Shia, Sunni, Ahmedi, Bori, Aga Khani etc. How is this different from Hindu's saying brahmin, Kshatriya etc. Its not fair to assign labels to any religion without a complete evaluation- so all you people here; please understand that no scripture from any religion says people are different . This is more a cultural phenomenon that we South Asians in particular propagate without learning to practice the true spirit of our faith.
    So next time don't accuse any religion including Hinduism of such practices. FYI casteism is not a part of any of the Hindu religious texts including The GITA , The Vedas and the Upanishads. It was a practice that came into effect as a result of people being classified by profession in the early days.
    As a hindu with muslim friends, I am very respectful of Islam and think Muslims need to learn to practice their faith without condeming or assigning titles to other religions based on their half baked knowledge of the latter.

  7. Brother nomicool,

    I myself am in the same situation as you are right now. I am 25yr old well educated man whom would like to marry a woman of my choice. She is 24yrs old. Her family would not accept me although they have no legitimate reason besides this caste system. I've tried my best to convince her to convince her parents but her father has refused once and she is scared to make a second, more stronger attempt. I myself cannot stop seeing and neither can she. We both feel as if we will regret if we go our seperate ways. Her parents are currently looking for a husband for her and she has made verbal communication with these prospects but cannot marry anyone besides me, neither will she let go of me. I feel you every word and wish there was a solution to this problem. Everyday I pray to allah asking him to bring her to me otherwise I do not see a purpose for living. Parents are so arrogrant and they will never understand. Its as if I am holding a sign on my forehead that says my caste system. This day and age people should look at the family and how the person is rather than his ancestry. Main things to look at are education, manners, and respect. That should be the basis of whether this person is right for my daughter rather where I am from back home. I have been borned and raised in the US. We live in the 21st centrury for gods sakes!!!! Arrogant people make me sick and there is no excuse for them to behave this way. If you ask me, they are the ones that are low class if they think in such manner. I wish I would end this descrimination just like how MLK Jr. ended descrimation against black people. Allah, please guide these elder parents to the right path!!!!!!!!!

  8. Thankyou everyone for their replies. I will try to address everyone's remarks.

    First off, I have NOT been dating this girl...I told about her to my parents in the beginning (5 months into my relationship with her) and not at the end. 3 months, out of those 5 months, she was not in this country, and I hadnt ever met her. When she came back, I met her once just to see her...in a public mall...for around 5 minutes...dint even sit with her anywhere...just stood and said Asalamoalaikom so we could be introduced face to face with each other, as we had been talking online before that.

    I met her one or two more times after that, and then decided that I should go ahead and tell about her to my parents, and stop meeting her like this, because she was not my girlfriend, and I was seeing her from a different perspective; i.e. of making her my wife. Discussed this with her as well and told her that until our parents can agree, we should not be meeting each other, and she happily agreed (not many girls agree to this).

    Girls today want to meet the boy every other day...want the boy to take them out for dinner...want to give them gifts etc...but this girl never asked me for anything...

    I think I was justified in talking to her and meeting her a few times, to reach this decision of marrying her....I believe I cant just know a girl for one day, talk to her and meet her once, and just go and tell my parents on the second day that I want to marry her. I HAVE to know the girl properly in order to make this decision, and thats why these 5 months were taken by me, to tell my parents...and I dont think so that I did it late...I did it at the right time...in the beginning...before we would get into any sinful activities or lose respect in the eyes of each others' families or in the society.

    My parents ignored my requests in the beginning twice when I wanted to tell about her to them. I had to involve someone else who asked my parents to talk to me, and only then did they sit down to listen to me. Their reaction on my question as to why they ignored me twice and did not talk to me was, "we thought you would forget it..."

    This shows, they were non serious about it from the very beginning, for God knows what reasons! I really dont understand. It was around a year before they actually sat down and listened to me, after the involvement of my cousin who asked them to talk to me!

    The reasons they gave me later on for rejecting my choice, after visiting the girl, were that, "she does not 'suit' with you"..."let us find a match for you"...."she is not that good looking"...

    All these reasons have no value for me, as I like the girl, and I have to live with her....not my parents! Had they any issues on the girl's character, I would listen to them knowing that they're saving me from a girl who has a lose character...but they DID NOT comment about her character at all, and I know they dont have any point to comment on her character, because Alhamdolillah she is a very clean and pure girl! So, my family has social problems and not economical problems (as I conclude from their remarks).

    About the the suggestion as to I should just go ahead and marry this girl; well, in the society I live; the way I have been brought up; we have very close ties with our parents...I have lived with my parents all my life...they have brought me up...they have financed me during my studies...they have given me everything...from food to car to everything...I CANNOT just go against them! And I have to think about the girl as well.

    In our society, when the girl is married, she leaves her home and enters the home of the boy, where she has to live with the boy's parents as well. Atleast, in the very beginning, every girl has to live with the parents of the boy she marries...later on they can get their own home, or shift somewhere else etc. So tell me, if my parents dont agree to the marriage, then HOW can I bring this girl in my home??? Even if I do, my parents would only insult and malign her, and would make her life hell! I CANNOT take ANY step like that, which will have a permanent adverse affect on both our lives!

    I can only go ahead with the marriage, if my parents agree!

    May Allah guide me and my parents to the right path! Ameen!

    • Salaams nomicool,

      Please forgive me, I misunderstood your explanations before. I am sorry to listen that you are still struggling with your situation.

      You are right about your thoughts, you cannot take someone your family don´t accept because they will make their life impossible if you are living together. That shows the softness of your Heart, Jazak Allahu Khairan.

      Ameen to your prayer.

      María
      IslamicAnswers.com Editor

      • Nomicool,

        When I had just turned 22, a guy came to me on the very last day of university and informed me of his intentions of liking me and wanting to spend the rest of his life with me. I rejected, though I respected him having seen him in different student organizations. Afterwards somehow, my heart inclined towards him after many istakhara duas.

        After that, we too never met. He has never seen me without hijab to date. And his stand has been the very same as yours. He made his inclination known to his parents. And then waited tiil his sister got married n it was his turn... 4 years went by this way.

        Finally after his sister's marriage, when his turn came, his parents denied him. They too perhaps thought he will forget despite a number of occasions when he made his intention known passively.

        Now it has been 2 years since he has been trying n his parents dont agree.

        Reason? Caste! Nothing else.

        Now after 6 years.. life's a mess. Can't go forward. Can't go backward. Can't part. Patience we exercised, limits we maintained despite being adults, both earning extremely handsomely, having our own cars and all kind of independence that could be misused - but we don't.. because we are answerable to Allah.

        He has same reasons like yours, and yes one should love and respect parents and never leave taking care of them.

        Take it from me - much longer experienced in this than you - your first BIG and FATAL mistake - you have given your parents the assurance that you will never do anything without their 'raza'. So they are resting assured - you'll cry, you'll scream - heck you'll do whatever - but if they don't budge - you won't do anything.

        We have false expectations of selfless love and understanding from our parents - the hope that they WILL understand and accept because they love us so. Truth? Yes, they love us and everything, but they love their own gods of community, wealth, social status and the god of 'what will people say' more.

        My 6 years of experience would sincerely advise you - Please don't fool yourself and DEFINITELY don't fool the girl. You will ruin her! She will keep waiting for you, that's the kind of character she has - the kind of character I have - and you will keep trying to soften your parents and they won't.. years will go by and both of you will age. You know full well what ages beyong 25 years begin to translate for girls in this society...

        Either have the guts to be VERY clear with your parents. Or prepare an exit strategy. Either your exit strategy is from your parent's house. or from this girl. Guys like you can not pull it through.. although I pray I am wrong and I pray that somehow, by some miracle, Allah softens your parents hearts... but this is a miracle I have asked and cried and prayed for for 6 years... to no avail.

        Pay heed.

        Wassalam.

  9. Thank you very much for your replies and prayers. LikeThatGirl, Your situation is so much similar to mine. Thanks for sharing. I have made this plan, that I will get a print out of these replies and show them to my parents, and maybe inshAllah these might change their views...when these words are coming from OTHER people, who know about religion well! May Allah help me! Ameen.

  10. You can try print outs brother... they won't help.

    You have to carry your own weight and put your foot down.

    Try the print outs... but, after that, either get up on your feet - you have to loose some to gain some. Or say bye bye to the girl and let her be.

    Note - Parents can NEVER be left. And you must never leave them. But temporarily, you have to do something to the effect because well... their hearts are just not soft and warm for you if you want the girl you like.

    You have two paths:
    1) Do something that temporarily makes ur parents feel, 'Okay... he is an independent individual now. Not just our baby boy'. You might get reaction. But eventually, things will settle down. You get the girl, and after some time, you get your parents back

    2) You don't take any temporrary backlash, stay with your parents stance through your current demeanor and loose the girl forever.

    The third way is the way of the miracle ... and that my dear boy, like i said, takes years.. and then too you have no guarantee that it will work out. The longer you stay in this and make the girl stay in this... the more all other ways become closed.. harder.

  11. assalamualaikum

    am in love with a girl from last 5 years . we both love each other my parents agreed to my choise but her parents didnt . they r telling her if she goes against them then the complete family will consume poison . and she doesnt want to go against her parents but i want her to be my life partner. i request for some dua which can change their mind

    • Walaykum as salam brother afaq hussain,

      Pray to Allah(swt) with all your Heart, pray in the silent of your own being without telling anybody, pray knowing consciously everyone of the Names and Attributes of our Lord, call Him(swt) for everyone of His Names, He(swt) listens to you, with the security in your Heart that you have been listened pray everyday till you get an answer, insha´Allah.

      Keep it between your Heart and Allah(swt) and move forward thinking that whichever is the solution (marrying her or not) you will feel it clear inside of your Heart, insha´Allah. Don´t talk about it, this is very personal, you will know the solution, soon, insha´Allah.

      Allah(swt) knows best.

      All my Unconditional Respect,

      María
      IslamicAnswers.com Editor

  12. Assalamu alaykum Brother Afaq Hussain,

    Consume poison?

    Tell them clearly if they are Muslims : Each soul earneth on it's own account. No laden one shall bear the burden of another - Surah Al An'am.

    If they live it is their choice and if they drink poison it is their choice. If you do not do anything wrong, there can be no blame upon you. Afterall marriage by choice as prescribed by Allah is the right of every individual.

    There is no need to be crazy. If you fear (fitna) then best is to wait paitently. Both of you, wait patiently.

    Ask her to tell her parents : " If would be happy if you bless me now, and if you do not, I would wait until you bless me".

    Your patience will show your willingness and level of commitment, wait patiently. Insha Allah, it will help you gain what you want or get something better than that which you could not get.

    If she is ready to wait, then begin the wait. Stay away from desires, do not meet and mix and get in to unnecessary contact with the girl, Allah does not love such deeds.

    So you try to please Allah and Allah will please you with immense rewards, if He wills.

    * * *

  13. thanks for all ur response and solutions . even u brothers and sisters pray for me
    thanks in advance

  14. thanks for all ur response and solutions . but she is not ready to tell her parents as she is only 1 daughter brought up love and care by her parents now she doesnt want to go against her parents . do u have any perticular dua which can help me

  15. Assalamu alaykum,

    A du'a which Moosa (peace be upon him) said and it turned out to be his marriage with one of the daughters of Shuayb (peace be upon him). This du'a is good for all times. Just one line.

    Surah Al Qasas:

    23. And when he came unto the water of Midian he found there a whole tribe of men, watering. And he found apart from them two women keeping, back (their flocks). He said: What aileth you? The two said: We cannot give (our flocks) to drink till the shepherds return from the water; and our father is a very old man.
    24. So he watered (their flock) for them. Then he turned aside into the shade, and said: My Lord! I am needy of whatever good thou sendest down for me.25. Then there came unto him one of the two women, walking shyly. She said: Lo! my father biddeth thee, that he may reward thee with a payment for that thou didst water (the flock) for us. Then, when he came unto him and told him the (whole) story, he said: Fear not! Thou hast escaped from the wrongdoing folk.
    26. One of the two women said: O my father! Hire him! For the best (man) that thou canst hire is the strong, the trustworthy.
    27. He said: Lo! I fain would marry thee to one of these two daughters of mine on condition that thou hirest thyself to me for (the term of) eight pilgrimages. Then if thou completest ten it will be of thine own accord, for I would not make it hard for thee. Allah willing, thou wilt find me of the righteous.
    28. He said: That (is settled) between thee and me. Whichever of the two terms I fulfil, there will be no injustice to me, and Allah is Surety over what we say.

    Say whenever you are confused or when you seek anything : My Lord ! I am needy of whatever good you send down for me.

    Salaam.

    * * *

  16. Salam-ppl

    I just wanted some islamic advise in what to do best!, I have chosen a guy and think he is the right person for me. we both love eachother and his parents love me and want me to get married to him,

    (Remainer of question deleted by Editor)

    • SajidaTK,

      Please log in and submit your question as a separate post. Any further questions asked within comments will be deleted.

      SisterZ
      IslamicAnswers.com Editor

  17. salaam

    i have exactly the same case as nomicool but only difference is age i am 27.apart from that my situation is word to word of nomicool.i have tried hard to convince my parents bringing family members even our imam but they never agreed.now i have put my hope in Allah and i liked the advise by maria m that one should seek deeply Allah and ask for best for both of us.

    thnx everyone

  18. aoa guys.... i want to share my personal experience with you guys (Question deleted by Editor)

    • Meero,

      Please log in and submit your question as a separate post, thank you.

      SisterZ
      IslamicAnswers.com Editor

  19. Salam, I have a semi similar situation but a little different and I'm lost here...

    • Wa alaykum as-alam Mahmoud. Please log in and write your question as a separate post, and we'll answer you in turn Insha'Allah.

      Wael
      IslamicAnswers.com Editor

  20. Wasallam Wael, I did make account and post but it has been pending for 2 days.

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