Can my mother-in-law tell my husband not to spend time with me?
Salam aleykum. It's again me Yasmin.
IslamicAnswers.com Editor's Note: sister Yasmin's previous question is here:
Can my husband divorce me because his mother required it?
May Allah bless you all, Allah yibarek fekum! I am sorry to have to touch this subject again but i do not understand why my mother in law hates me in this way! I explained before i broke plates in her house and she was very disappointed and my son broke her mirror so she blamed me for all this! I understand she has the right over her things and to ask me for account and i respect this strictness in her is good!
I accepted so far everything calmly up to now but since my husband started warning me with divorce and that i had to go and beg her for forgiveness and bend on my knees and ask them if i can sleep on the stair in front of their house i stopped talking to her because i believed she was much nicer then that and she started all the sudden with the hateful towards me behaviors.
She has educated her son to be her slave which is fine islamically is a good thing that he obeys her but i stopped talking to her because this behaviour was strange for me because i never had much interaction with her and i do not know her well! So of course i am her target now! And i am very repented for what i have done just i didn't have courage to call her yet! What happens is that my husband has first wife which is like 19 years older than me and she also doesn't like me and has threatened me roughly in many ocassions and i respect her very much and love her as my sister but now her behaviour towards me made me dislike her!
So basically i am the easy target in this family and they do not like me for sure! My mother in law seems to feel very jealous in the small ocassions i see my husband since he lives with all his family in USA and since i cannot have access to there yet i wait in my country! So i do not take her son away from her nor i do not wish him to be for me only! I only wish that they do not hate me that is all that there is a peace !
My husband tried talking to his mother in front of me on the phone and asked her that she reconcile with me just as he did and she started yeiling at him and telling him he was not standing for his family and means i am not part of the family and i am the enemy! I feel very sad! If i am not desired i wish not to stay in this marriage !
She commanded him to go back to the USA since he came to see me for 1 week in my country and i have a small child from him! Why she hates me so much? Why she said this, i was so nice to her and loved her as my own mother and i still do and i am very confused from her words. Or she is very jealous because her son really has love affection for me and prefers spending time with me? Or she doesn't wana share him with any other woman? Which one can be?
- Yasmin_86
31 Responses »
Leave a Response
Entries(RSS)
as-salamualaikum,
really sorry for this trouble. all i can say is that she doesn't like you for somereason and there is nothing wrong with you. you seem like a nice girl, and sometimes mothers in law are like this. it is not uncommon for the mother in law or other in-laws to behave badly with the girl. but here is the point that i think makes THE difference. your husband's reaction to all this. does he defend you, stand-up for you, and believe you when you tell him what happened? or does he belittle you, accuse you, say you are lying about his family, make you apologize to them, humiliate you in front of them, and make you feel like it's you against them? was the marriage done without the parents knowledge/permission? some parents, because of their culture, fail to realize that their son is an individual who can make his own descisions in life. they want to control everything, how he practices religion, job, specific type of wife..... now for the issue with his wife, i would not blame her. i once read a true story of a polygymist cult. the woman described how married men would flirt with her when she was single and their wives would get so jealous, but she thought she will be a good wife and not get jealous with her husband's other wives. then when she finally became the young and favorite wife of a mn who already had a number of wives, she didn't understand why some of these wives wouldn't talk to her or were so rude. she thought they were bad women. she even describes how the first day she went to the house, her husband left all the wives and went into the bedroom with his first wife. this was the first time she started understanding the jealousy that the other women felt. then she describes how he made promises to her and told her of his love to her but started bringing in wives even after her without her knowing it. now she understood why some of the previous wives were so rude. so don't blame his wife too much.
by the way, it is ilegal in usa to have more than one wife.
Salaams,
From what I understand, you got married to a man from the US who already has a wife 19 years older than you. You also have a child with him but you still reside in your home country.
This horrible behaviour from your mother-in-law could well be that she is loyal to your husbands first wife and thus disapproved of his marriage to you.
You really need to have this out with your husband, after all he took you as his wife. He needs to fully support you, especially emotionally in this matter. However, I say your husband is a coward and a mummy's boy and what he asked of you to beg to sleep on the doorstep is disgraceful! Whatever did he marry you for in that case? And does he or his mother not have any regard for your child?
You need to talk to your husband and try to get a respected elder to assist in dealing with the monster-in-law.
When you talk with your husband, don't try to much to convince him of his mother's mistreatment of you, just discuss yourselves and your child together and what is planned for your future.
Regards
Hopeful
Heh heh, "monster-in-law", I like that. Anyway I agree with everything Hopeful has written. This treatment is outrageous and has nothing to do with obedience to parents. Just as children have an obligation to show respect to elders, elders must show compassion to youngers, and that latter part of this formula is sorely lacking in your situation.
I think it's time for you and your husband to live in your own household, apart from your mother-in-law. There is now way you will have a peaceful household and a happy marriage otherwise.
Wael
IslamicAnswers.com Editor
Assalamu'alaikum,
Sister Hopeful, I hope you can clear something up for me. Is this the norm in the Indo/Pak community? There have been so many instances where these issues have come up on this site that I have begun to think that this is normal. I understand that we should obey our parents but there has to be a limit. We all know what is right and what is wrong. At what point do these men begin to stand up, take their backbone back from wherever it was and be men.
I have recently been asked for advice in a situation where a sister is living in her in-laws house in one room with her children. She is unable to leave the house without the in-laws permission. The sad thing is that the husband thinks that this is fine because it's what his mother wants. There are other thing's going just as bad in the house.
The question I have is this, is this way of thinking so ingrained in the culture that we can't change it?, or do the families of the girls looking to get married need to do a better job of investigating the young man and his family when they begin to look for a husband for their daughter?
I'm looking for advice so that we can better address these issues. I am not of that culture so I'm looking for help from anyone.
Your Brother in Islam
Abdul Wali
IslamicAnswers.com Editor
Assalamu Alaikum brother Abdul Wali,
I am a Pakistani and proud to be one…but, I do agree that there are some Pakistani men who don’t respect their wives …brother some of these people(what I have seen) come from a background where ppl are still living in the time of the jahiliya!Also, its lack of education….according to them they follow the culture (because that’s what their elders have taught them and they cannot be wrong!) and not the religion!And brother Pakistan was once part of India…therefore we have adopted many things from the hindu culture….(that’s my opinion some ppl don’t have to agree with me! thats fine). What I find amusing is that they learn to respect their own parents but don’t give the same respect to their wives parents….so, they remember the rights of their mother but forget the rights of their wives…infact according to some men rights of the wives don’t even exist!!
Brother, in a pakistani or indian culture when a husband helps his wife with anything some people call them (there is a saying in punjabi) bodi the thale laga hai…I had rather not translate that saying!Basically, that he is a slave of his wife!They don’t like it!Plus, they(husband) have to show there the man of the house…and since they are the head everything has to go their way….either that or there family/friends or neighbours will call them coward….!
btw the mother and daughter in law fight(amongst Pakistanis,Indians,bangladeshi) has been going on for decades! It started even way before the partition of India!!To my knowledge anyway!!!So, I guess as Iv previously mentioned we (us pakistanis)have adopted the culture of the non muslims....We say we are the Ummah of Prophet Muhammad(PBUH) but some of us fail to follow the teachings of our beloved Prophet(PBUH)….
However, brother honestly speaking there are also (as hard as it may sound) some pakistani men who do treat their wives with respect….I guess it depends on the way people have been brought up…Additionally,in our culture it is expected that once you get married you have to stay with your inlaws for some time…some move after 6/7 months or even after a year or two whereas others live with their in laws forever….but, to be fair now more and more couples have their own house/flats….where they live on their own and visit their parents….or their in laws visit them and stay with them….this way they( wives) have a healtheir relation with their in laws
I heard this short(true) story from someone which I would like to share!This newly wed couple had jus come from their honeymoon and the husband asked her to stay with her mum and look after her and to obey her. Her husband obeyed her mother and loved her so much that he use to ignore his wife and every time he use to speak to his wife it use to be about his mother!The husband only use to see his wife at night.The wife got really tired of her husband ignoring her and so she decided to do something about it!the wife decided to sleep in the same room as her mother in law!!Plus, she continued to spend time with her mother in law during the day aswell!After a while her husband didn’t like the fact that her wife was paying so much attention to his mum…and so he asked her wife to move back in their room and since then he did pay attention to his wife aswell…I guess some times you have to give them the taste of their(husbands) own medicine!now it might not work out for other people but for the above couple it did!So, you never know…
And last but nt the least brother Pakistani men can change for the better infact, not jus pakistani men but all the muslim men and women can change if and only if they follow the Quran and Sunnah….and I think the only way this could happen is if we truly want to learn ...also parents should teach their children about Islam….the true Islam and not what we have been taught(with due respect) by our elders!Also, if the Imams take full responsibility as some(Im not saying every imam does that!Cuz THEY DON’T!)Imams pick and choose the Sunnahs of our Prophet(PBUH)while they ignore other Sunnahs!For example(please correct me if im wrong) on the nikkah nama document a bride can ask the groom to give her the divorce on certain conditions such as if he ill-treats her….but, some Imam cut this bit out!The main point here is that we need to learn about Islam and if we will then InshaAllah we will become a better person....and Allah knows best....
Assalamu'alaikum 2250sb,
Thank you very much for your response. That was very helpful. I have to tell you, my wife is from Pakistan, and she told me that she experienced the same problems in her first marriage. When she told me her story I thought that it was an isolated case, but when I started responding to post on this site I began to see that there are so many stories just like hers.
I agree that we all need to be better educated in Islam. We should respect our elders but if what they are telling you is cultural and goes against what is said in Islam then it is your duty and with respect, you have to say no. To protect yourself from seeming as if you don't respect their decisions you must bring your proof either from Quran or sunnah.
So the best thing that any family can do when looking for a husband for their daughter is to find out as much about the young man and his family as possible. Make sure that his character is good and that he is man enough to make his own decisions. Also, the most important thing is to make sure his deen is sound and that he has full knowledge of what his rights are as a husband but she also should be well grounded in her deen and know her rights as a wife. If she doesn't know her rights then it is the responsibility of her parents or guardian to teach her.
Thank You.
Your Brother in Islam
Abdul Wali
IslamicAnswers.com Editor
Walaikum Assalam brother Abdul,
JazakAllah Khair.....You see brother when Pakistani parents search for the potential son in law...they look for education/looks/background/job.....but noone asks whether the brother is a practising muslim! Unfortunately, I have realized ONLY recently how important it is to have a practising husband.And brother your absolutely right....if our elders go against the Islam we should tell them that they are wrong with respect ofcourse....but some times it is considered as being rude!!and being argumentative...!!it can get very hard at times....but its not impossible...
And brother I couldnt agree more it is the duty of the parents to educate their children.
Ps. So good to know that you have treated your wife with respect MashaAllah....May Allah swt bless your marriage and keep you and your wife healthy and happy always Ameen.
pzl help ...
(Question deleted. Please log in and submit your question as a separate post. IslamicAnswers.com Editor)
Salaams Brother Abdul Wali,
Sister 2250sb has provided a fair account of the problems relating to men from Indo/Pak community. There have also been comments from other sisters relating to the post
'We moved to Pakistan and I became like a prisoner'
The sisters have accurately described the nature of these men, such as being possessive, uncaring and narcisstic.
The main essence of the problem is the lack of regard for women, bar their own mothers. The mothers are domineering and smotherly. The mother being the main carer of the child never fails to remind the son of his duty to her (her son may be the only male who will ever respect her). In this culture, the birth of a son is a big event. It gives his mother status. But the advent of a baby girl is a disappointment, seen as an inadequacy on the womans part. However concerning women in general, their mothers, despite being women themselves instil this mysogony from childhood. Plus the sons see how to mistreat a wife from the male example in their fathers.
Thus the men have an attitude that the rules don't apply to them but are so harsh to their wives. They only exploit Islam and twist things to suit their own perverse natures eg. The angels curse a wife who refuses her husband his rights. But does the husband treat his wife with respect and kindness? Not in most cases. As a wife is just treated as a possession, an unpaid whore who is not allowed to have any feelings or express any objections to unfair treatment.
You will find that most of these men have no proper Islamic knowledge at all. They only know of mumbo jumbo inherited from hindu customs. They certainly have no idea of how to treat a wife Islamically. The wife is blamed for everything, expected to stay mute and obey. Also the wife and children have far less priority than friends. Also it is not uncommon for wives to be left in a state of abandonment whilst the husband goes off supposedly for work purposes but most likely to swan about like a single man devoid of responsibilities.
I don't think this problem will ever go away. Most of the Pakistanis lack any deen and only seem to be obsessed with material wealth. That may well be seen as a sweeping generalisation but its true. I am Pakistani and not proud at all. I have no time for nationalism and am only concerned with describing myself as Muslim.
In any case there is good and bad in every society, however Pakistanis have predominately behaved in the ways described above. It is so ingrained in their mentality, and worst of all, they don't care about it to change it. As you rightly said the only way to break this trend is to seek a spouse who is a good Muslim. However many get forced into marriages, even covertly manipulated and emotionally blackmailed into marrying someone who is not suitable (as in my case).
The best thing is to educate ourselves and trust in Allah. Ensure the younger generations have the correct understanding, so that these backward cultural ways can be eradicated.
Regards,
Hopeful
That is a big generalization .......
As a wife is just treated as a possession, an unpaid whore who is not allowed to have any feelings or express any objections to unfair treatment.
That is pretty sick statement . You should be careful with your words . What do you mean by unpaid whore ... can you explain a bit more . Sorry to say this .... but I think you , yourself lack some basic islamic knowledge .
Not all pakistani men are like the one you described above . There are also women who are more evil then men .
People like you are always ready to criticize anything about Pakistan . You never have seen those happy households .
You should open up your eyes and talk to every married couple before giving such an ignorant comment/statement .
P.S I seriously don't know why the moderators of this site allowed such a hateful comment with biggest generalization of all time .
And btw @hopeful
The description of men that you gave above .. applies to illiterate and poor people of Pakistan .
I seriously don't know where you lived in Pakistan because the place where I live . The women there have every liberty and freedom just like the women in west . They have their own cars , apartments or houses, their own private servants and their husbands shower them with money .
And besides they are just stay at home moms . Just look at their lifestyle . You'll be amazed .
I have also seen couples in which the female is more dominant than the male partner .
Unfortunately most people in Pakistan only see one-side of the story . The information they get is mostly from unreliable western news channel or media .
Most of my friends are Sindhi ( People from Sindh province ) . Do you know their culture . They turn away their faces when they see a non-mahram women . They always keep their head low when they talk to a female . Their females don't work at all . Their husband work day and night to keep their families happy(especially their wives ).
You said that Pakistani culture is bad huh ?
I seriously don't understand why do I always see people bashing Pakistan without any concrete evidences .
One or two bad cases doesn't represent the majority .
Whenever people talk about women oppression in Pakistan . Saudi Arabia comes to my mind . Western media makes documentaries and publish news which portray Saudi women as oppressed . If this was the case, then 85% of the saudi women wouldn't have said that they like the current system and are satisfied with it .
As a wife is just treated as a possession, an unpaid whore who is not allowed to have any feelings or express any objections to unfair treatment.
You think this statement describe Pakistani men .
Let me tell you how things work , here in west . Men in west ( majority) of them if not all . They first develop a friendship with a woman . Second they have regular sex with no strings attached under the umbrella term of Boyfriend/girlfriend . When I say no strings attached it means no marriage or proof of commitment . When the boy gets bored , he dumps the girl and move on .
Now tell me who is the unpaid whore ? .
I was just amazed at your thinking (hopeful) as you termed a wife as unpaid whore . Do you even know the meaning of that word .
This really shows your mentality . I have nothing more to say
P.S I seriously don't know why the moderators of this site allowed such a hateful comment with biggest generalization of all time .
I should have edited the comment before approving it. I didn't read it carefully enough.
Wael
IslamicAnswers.com Editor
@Sister Hopeful and @sister 2250sb, I think we cannot make such sweeping statements. After all in this case sisters is in problems due to unreasonable behavior from her mother in law and her husband's first wife. Similarly I have seen mother-in-laws of men, who draw them away from their own mother. Does it mean that all Pakistani women are bad, definitely not.
@Brother Abdul Wali there are always two sides to the story, the problem with relationship advice is that we are looking only at one side of the problem but not the other side.
Sister Yasmin, I hope Allah give your mother-in-law hidaya to be a mother to you and see you as her daughter instead of someone from outside. As someone who has seen similar situations I can say that the best strategy is to keep quiet when your mother in law is taunting you or something similar, unless she does not talks to you directly. [If you are living with her]
The problem with mother in laws in Pakistan is that they have lived all their lives in their homes. Their husbands have been providing to them and they don't even have to go out to do simple tasks. Their whole lives are spent handling their children and raising them and taking care of their husbands. Once their children grow and move out and their husbands are not there any more they have nothing else to do. Also, old age plays a lot of tricks on a person. The problem with your husband's first wife is that you are 19 years younger to her. Put yourself in her shoes and then think. I am not saying she is right and you are wrong, I am just giving a perspective to understand the problem.
I don't know what is the story with your husband, I think if he is a good man than he must realize that he must be fair with you and his first wife. Its not clear what is the living situation, does your husband live with his first wife in USA and you live with your mother-in-law or is it something else.
I hope it helps.
May Allah help us and guide us all.
regards
Assalamu Alaikum concerned,
With due respect I disagree with you....If you read my earlier comments dear brother/sister you will realize that I have not been biased! What I have mentioned about pak/indo men didnt start recently but has been goin on for decades....you dont have to agree with me.....but dear brother/sister we cannot change the reality.....unfortunately it exists....And I agree that not all Pakistani/indian men are bad....please read my comments again....there are some good ones too...and I have mentioned that aswell....and sister/brother what I mentioned was nothing to do with this sister yasmin case!! Brother Abdul wali wanted to know as you are probably aware bro/sis regarding the Pakistani culture so I told him what I have seen....throughout my life....but without being biased...
And sis/bro you need to read my comments again!I never stated that all pakistani men are bad...
I stated in my earlier comments ."but, I do agree that there are SOME Pakistani men who don’t respect their wives …"this statement is enough to prove that I did not say that "ALL" pakistani men are bad....
Furthermore, I stated "And last but nt the least brother Pakistani men can change for the better infact, not jus pakistani men but all the muslim men and women can change if and only if they follow the Quran and Sunnah"....
And I couldnt agree more with you sister/brother there is always two side of the story...but there is no excuse for violence....full stop
Please forgive me if I have said anything to hurt you....believe me dear brother/sister that was not my intention....but please brother/sister read my statements again before you reply....And Allah knows best
JazakAllah
btw sister/brother my following answer was for this statement you made "Similarly I have seen mother-in-laws of men, who draw them away from their own mother. Does it mean that all Pakistani women are bad, definitely not."
"And sis/bro you need to read my comments again!I never stated that all pakistani men are bad...I stated in my earlier comments ."but, I do agree that there are SOME Pakistani men who don’t respect their wives …this statement is enough to prove that I did not say that "ALL" pakistani men are bad...."
Assalamu'alaikum to all,
My question was not meant to start an argument. All I wanted was some clarification about this being an ingrained cultural problem. I wanted to know what were your feelings in terms of how we go about fixing it in the future.
I also know that all Pakistani men are not bad as my brother in-law is great and I know many Pakistani brothers who don't fit that description. We have good and bad in all groups and we can't paint one particular group with a broad brush.
The main thing that we have to focus on is learning to raise our sons as men, and mother's knowing when to let go and remove their sons hands from the apron strings. We also have to teach our daughter's how to be strong Muslimahs and to know their deen.
Your brother is Islam
Abdul Wali
IslamicAnswers.com Editor
Asalaamualaikum Brother Abdul Wali,
I have not looked at this discussion till now, I just noticed your comments and have just briefly whizzed through some of the other comments.
Its an interesting topic you have raised because the issue of Pakistani/Indian mother in laws is clearly an issue. I am of Pakistani origin myself so have seen various cases. Of course there are good husbands and mother in laws from this background aswell (my two brother in laws are outstanding examples Alhumdulillah). But unfortunately there is a predominant culture that has polluted the wider community. I know someone locally who has come from Pakistan, she is a a second wife to man who lost his first wife in an accident. Her husband's children are young teenagers, they beat her and abuse and her husband does not speak a word. Her parents in law whom she lives with, tell her to stay quiet and bear the abuse because they dont want to risk upsetting their grand-children. What really bothers and angers me is that these specific 'Parents in law' are respected by the wider community in which I live. I want to do something for this woman, but I know from experience that it is a slow and frustrating process.
I completely agree with you Abdul Wali, we need to try and find a way for Mothers to raise their sons in a way which does not weaken their personalities, but instead strengthens them. This 'Mother and Son syndrome' as I usually refer to it, is a very unattractive part of the Pakistani/Indian culture and I pray it changes for the better. We also need to educate women about their Islamic rights and the rights and duties of both parents and children need to be clarified, re-defined and understood, because as we have seen, without this, it is easy to be taken advantage of. There is also an element of extreme guilt that children (no matter what age) are made to feel by parents if they disagree with something or hold a different opinion.
I pray that with education of deen and dunya, these unattractive cultural traits will disappear.
SisterZ
IslamicAnswers.com Editor
Very well said sisterz and brother abdul.....
My intention was not to hurt or argue with anyone.......but, if anyone was hurt by my comments then I do apologize....
I can understand that brother Abdul Wali asked a question which could have been answered simply without bashing a particular country.
The only reason I addressed Sister ssb2250's and Sister Hopeful's posts(together) was to try to set the record straight. This domestic violence and mother-in-law problems are well known and I think we all agree that there are good and bad people in every society and not everybody is like that.
The second reason I wanted to say what I said was bashing of people from Pakistan.
Pakistani people are this and that. Not only in this post but on other posts I have seen people bashing other people as well. I can also start bashing other muslim majority countries with data and start telling horror stories of domestic violence or bad men or women. I can start saying that X country's women are 'this' or Y country's men are 'that' but what purpose does it serve?
Lastly but most importantly, I can only say that telling horror stories does not serve a purpose unless we are seeking advice for some specific problem. I think if I see something wrong than I should try to help in correcting that wrong,
(as its mentioned in this hadith:)
‘He who amongst you sees something abominable should modify it with the help of his hand; and if he has not strength enough to do that, then he should do it with his tongue; abhor it from his heart; and that is the least of faith.’
— Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) Sahih Muslim Hadith 79
Instead of telling others that X people do this and that , i should try to help them to solve the problem,
as its mentioned in this hadith:
"He who relieves a hardship of this Dunya (this earthly life)
for a believer, Allah will relieve a hardship of the Day of
Resurrection for him; he who makes it easy for an indebted
person, Allah will make it easy for him in the Dunya and
the Hereafter; he who covers a Muslim (his mistakes and
shortcomings), Allah will cover him in the Dunya and
the Hereafter; Allah will be in the slave 's need, as long as
the slave is in his (believing) brother's need…" [Saheeh Muslim]
Similarly in this hadith narrated by Abdullah Ibn Umar:
Abdullah Ibn Umar related, "The Messenger of Allah once rose above the podium and then heralded with a loud voice, 'O those who have embraced Islam only with their tongue, while Eeman has not yet entered their hearts, neither harm Muslims, nor mock them, nor try to expose their mistakes, for he who follows (or searches for) the errors of his brother (so that he exposes him), Allah will follow his errors, and he whom Allah follows his errors, He will expose him even if he was in the middle of his home.'" [Saheeh Al-Jamee]
Please see I am not saying that we should turn a blind eye to social issues, but we muslims can start solving these problems from our homes and our localities by raising our children in a better fashion and helping people around us.
And Allah knows the best.
May Allah guide us all.
regards
Salaams Concerned,
This topic covers important issues that need to be addressed. Most of us speak from personal experience and have collectively experienced the same trends. The objective was not to completely slate Pakistan and yes of course there are decent men and women amongst this nation.
However as Sister Z put it more eloquently and diplomatically;
' unfortunately there is a predominant culture that has polluted the wider community'
The overall points were the lack of Islamic education, the overbearing influences of mothers and their treatment of daughter-in laws and overall disrespect for women. This is a forum for advice and there is no harm in debate. There is also no need to conceal such issues that are perpetuating a cycle of misery and injustice for many women. It is not about humilating a people but about identifying and looking for solutions to these problems that are widespread.
I personally have been so strong in my opinions due to my own miserable experiences being somewhat still fresh in my memory.
Finally you mention no point in telling horror stories etc unless a seeking advice etc. But that is what is already being done. People sharing their problems and coming to people with advice.
We are Muslims first but cultural influences have overidden the true identity of Muslims in many nations. Some more than others. There is nothing wrong with culture unless it is in conflict with Islamic values.
Regards,
Hopeful
" unfortunately there is a predominant culture that has polluted the wider community"
I think this statement applies to all muslims not to Pakistan only. And yes majority of us mulims are on the wrong path not Pakistanis only. My problem here is that I don't want to quote examples from other countries.
Regarding stories, definitely no harm in debate and telling a story to describe the problem, as sister Yasmin_86 had problem and she told he problem. But my point is that what is the benefit of passing disparaging remarks about a group of people while answering these problems.
or sharing stories to belittle them.
"I heard this short(true) story from someone which I would like to share!This newly wed couple had jus come from their honeymoon..."
or
"I know someone locally who has come from Pakistan, she is a a second wife to man who lost his first wife in an accident. Her husband's children are young... "
etc.
One can put the point across without sharing disparaging remarks and stories. As you said yourself:
"It is not about humilating a people but about identifying and looking for solutions to these problems that are widespread."
In summary, I think people are here to ask answers to their problems. And while answering using my limited knowledge I should not taint my answers with my bad experiences, but rather augment them using lessons learned from those experiences.
May Allah guide me and guide us all.
regards,
Salaams again Concerned (for the reputation of pakistan),
At the end of the day, the truth isn't always pretty. Nevertheless, it isstill the truth.
You said 'I can understand that brother Abdul Wali asked a question which could have been answered simply without bashing a particular country.
But brother Abdul Wali's question was not about Muslims in general, he asked;
Is this the norm in the Indo/Pak community?
Thus answers were offered, relating to his question. Why would anyone answer that question with talking about any other ethnic groups. That's like someone being on trial but going on about someone else's faults in order to justify themselves.
Everybody is entitled to their opinions, but the answers to this question have been based on factual events and real experiences. If you browse through the many posts, there are rather alot of them, revolving around these same issues within the pakistani communities. And above all it relates to the sisters post.
People have presented stories to back up their statements and to illustrate that the sisters trouble is not an isolated case.
Lets agree to disagree. As this whole debate is going round in circles and being in denial or getting defensive never solves a problem.
Indeed may Allah rightly guide us all
salamualaikum, just my two cents......unfortunately the indo-pak culture is like that and the people there don't really think of it as bad as the ones who have been/born raised in the west. for example, and i have many examples, a woman told me that her brother favors his wife, spends money on her, spends time with her, and defends her/fights with his mother to defend his wife. so this lady was actually complaining to me that her brother shouldn't do that. she even said that her family doesn't like her brother for doing that. this lady had recently moved from pakistan, and i wasn't even born there. to me, i was like what the chickenoodles?! i had never heard such stuff in my family. i think most of pakistan in poor, like 70-80%. and a lot of these things stem from poverty and illiteracy. it's about money and greed. her brother should spend on her and her family, not on his wife. his wife is probably supposed to be their slave. and what scares me when people talk about religious guys is that pakistani religous guys have influence from pakistan. so if they pray, they are considered religious. but because of the culture there, they cannot understand a wife's rights properly. a wife has no respect, voice, opinion. i can tell you of all the "wonderful' stuff that i experienced, but it's too much to mention. all i know is i never want to visit my in-laws there again, or raise my kids there. i don't want my kids to become like those people ever. i think these issues are more of a problem when the guy was born/raised in pakistan and the girl was born/raised here. it's two completely different worlds. whats normal for us here is considered very good there, and what's normal for them there is considered very bad for us here. take for example a mother in law who curses at her grandkids. and i mean CURSES like she got a phd in that feild of cursology. to us, it's shocking and abusive. not to them, infact they brag to people that their daughter in law doesn't hit/yell/curse at her kids like it's something great. and bragging about daughters in law is to show themselves off actually. you know, look at us, we have a house, cars, our son is a doctor, he spends money on us, his wife is so good.......and once the people who they need to brag to are out of the picture- then it's back to the proffesion of monster-in-lawing. it must be fun, it seems like they love doing it.
Sister how about u call her up and ask her kindly and politely that " mother have I done something wrong that u dislike me so much, if I did please forgive me for it was not intentional" talk to her. Call her often, and try to make a bond. Try to b on the goodside of her, for ur husband is controlled by his mom. Try not to make situations worse then wat they already r. And don't make any bad decisions either. If u need a good relationship with ur husband, get an awesome relationship with ur mother in law for she controls ur man. Call her up, talk to her, ask her how's her day, how's she's feeling, if she went out to do shopping, etc watever women's talk about lol. etc watever women's talk about lol. Wish u all the best. Inshallah something will work out for u.
salamualaikum, sorry but i disagree. your intentions are very good but you don't know how some mils are. here's an example, a daughter in law who doesnt want her mil to do any housework, who wants to massage her feet/body for her(pakistani thing to massage the elders), who brings her food, and what does she get in return for her offers? yelling. claims that she is acting? a daughter in law who hides the mil's curses and put-downs because she doesn't want her husband to see this side of his mother, and what does she get? the mil takes full advantage of this, and uses it to her benefit. she knows she can get away with anything, and if the dil does tell her husband then the mil can just lie about what happened because the dil isn't too shrewd anyways. how can you talk to such a woman who curses at your kids and puts you down and intentionally lies about you to favor another dil that is related to her? luicky lucky is she who lives far away from such a mil.
I know wat u said is true, but ur pretty much tellin her to get a divorce because her mil is bein a nasty woman. She should wrk things out first, b4 she can just come to conclusions. I read her post too, and the mil is not the only one to blame! The husband needs to stand up for his wife also. He needs to tell his mom that hes married now, and not in diapers anymore and the mother can't b doin this to him. The mother is not doin in behind him, as she said the mom went off on the son when he told her to reconcile. Husband is to blame also. He needs firm grounds now that he is married. He needs to stand up for his wife.
yes i am not a scholar or a counselor, so i am afraid myself sometimes that i might be messing somebody up with my advice. i do agree about the part about the husbands, but some husbands just never get it. they cannot ever learn to stand up for their wives even if they are very well able to stand up for other women. i don't understand why. the husband is the key to the solution because it depends on his behavior. if a man can stand up for his wife, she can even live with her in-laws and all their crap knowing that atleast she has his loyalty, trust, and love. but if the husband is of no help, i don't really know what to say except that what can a wife do?! where will she go?! she just runs around feeling like garbage. somebody tell us what to do with such husbands and why they behave this way.
Cowgomoo am also paki so i know what goes on in paki culture lol.
To be treated unfair by pakistani men and the inlaws is completly normal in pakistan and the culture.I am American and white woman and I have had nothing but a life of missery with my Pakistani husband.The Pakistani inlaws just walk all over the girls.I was not allowed to leave the home unless i had permission and after the inlaws moved to USA they just took over my home like it was there home when i said somethign to my father inlaw he said it is my son homes meaning it is his home.I am sick of it .I have turned into a hateful person my own self .